T-boned today at Bedford: advice required

Discussion in 'General 1000RR Discussion' started by dmc12, Sep 22, 2020.

  1. Kentblade

    Kentblade Elite Member

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2012
    Messages:
    2,421
    Likes Received:
    1,808
    Can agree with TCs case.

    Was on at track day in France run by an English company and after a long delay due to the ambulance being off track taking a rider to the hospital, nearly half the day was lost, when it restarted there was only time for 2 sessions, inters went first , then we went on the last session, came off the straight towards a 180 loop, half way through a bike appeared in front of me and it suddenly stood up, I was probably travelling 50mph faster and despite picking mine up, I clipped the guys bar and he went down, red flags out, felling pretty bad as I returned to the pits, only to find out, they had also let a group of novices out who had moaned about lost track time just to placate them !!!

    Guy was steaming when he was recovered to the pits, and let rip at me when he found out it was me, after listening to his hissy fit about how fecking priceless his Duke was and how much I would have to pay for repairs, suddenly lost all sympathy for him, and left him in no doubt that his actions would have caused the same accident even in the novice group, due to his inability to ride his bike correctly.

    Ultimately the organisers made a massive balls up in their attempts to keep everyone happy. Track days great fun until it all goes wrong.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  2. Muffking

    Muffking God Like

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2012
    Messages:
    4,844
    Likes Received:
    2,289
    Not much I can add which hasn't already been mentioned.
    I particularly like @Kentblade 's comment, "Track days great fun until it all goes wrong", so very true. That's why I would say to take a bike that you can afford to drop and brake for spares if it all goes to shit.
    That said, group etiquette and the severity of crashes are a lottery. On that basis I can only suggest going out with the safest gear you can afford, especially as airbag suits are becoming more affordable.

    As for leather repair, like @Boothman mentioned, I can highly recommend https://www.lincsrepair.co.uk/ who are both affordable and specialise in motorcycle leathers. In fact the guy is a rider himself, who lives local to me and does a lot of repairs for the racers.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Thanks Thanks x 2
  3. PauloHRC

    PauloHRC God Like

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2017
    Messages:
    3,756
    Likes Received:
    2,757
    Hope you're on the mend @dmc12 ......that is some bad luck you've had there o_O

    Unfortunately there's a chance of this happening in any group you ride in, it only takes one guy to make a bad decision for a split second and its going to end badly.

    Think the guy could have had the courtesy to hold his hands up and at least see that you were ok!:rolleyes: but this is the chance we take when participating in this dangerous sport.

    Even the worlds elite racers make these kind of mistakes week in week out, Lowes in moto 2 a couple of weeks ago and Aleix Espagaro in moto gp this weekend just gone......... both took riders out in similar circumstances. So if they're at it what hope do the rest of us have :eek:o_O
     
    #23 PauloHRC, Sep 22, 2020
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2020
    • Agree Agree x 1
  4. tuktuk

    tuktuk Elite Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2015
    Messages:
    1,847
    Likes Received:
    1,157
    Hope you are back to full fitness soon enough.

    First day I done nearly put me off for life, it was like the wacky races watching people barging their way through with their elbows out, in the novice group o_O

    As said, being on track is a risk but each individual has to take responsibility and has a duty of care for themselves and others around them. For the person not to come over due to embarrassment is a joke, the consequences could have been life changing and the least you can do is show a bit of remorse whether it was a simple misjudgment or not.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  5. Empty_Ten

    Empty_Ten New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2020
    Messages:
    131
    Likes Received:
    173
    Speedy Recovery @dmc12

    Everything that I would say has been covered (and more eloquently as well).
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  6. SimonRR

    SimonRR Elite Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2012
    Messages:
    3,400
    Likes Received:
    1,420
    Sorry to hear this and hope all goes well, TD's do seem to have more idiots on them than they used to, had some close shaves but OK so far.
    Bring self employed and taking my new R1 on track means I always buy TD Insurance for damage and or total loss and personal Injury, eases the mind a bit I find.

    No TD's this tyear due to covid-19 but usually get a few in each year, you csn buy bulk days which works out cheaper per day, might add £100 to the day, but still cheaper than renting a track day bike out lol
     
    • Like Like x 3
  7. CharlieR85

    CharlieR85 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2016
    Messages:
    1,239
    Likes Received:
    418
    Get well soon mate.

    I've only done one TD in the novice group and the difference in standard was stark, I would have felt comfortable to move into the inters almost immediately. Do you normally ride in inters? I think its the variation in standard that makes the novice group more dangerous. Faster guys going round in the Novice group sucks poorer riders into going faster than they have the experience for.

    MSV don't do enough for Novices in my opinion. They should be explaining to people more about building up the pace slowly and spending the first few sessions just finding your braking markers and lines etc. Its just a free for all once that briefing box has been ticked!

    If they watched him cause an accident his day should be over.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Useful Useful x 1
  8. dmc12

    dmc12 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2018
    Messages:
    343
    Likes Received:
    218
    Agree racers outbrake themselves too - but they’re RACING! Not in the first session of the day in a novice track day group :rolleyes:

    For me this is where MSV have some responsibility - covid means there’s no briefings, no words of ‘cool it’, ‘this is how you overtake’, ‘these are the consequences for bad riding’ in the preceding minutes. Just an online briefing the day before which no-one listens to. So the proportion of hot headed dickheads is not mitigated in any way and combined with a complete lack of intent to manage bad riding subsequently, they are failing in their duty of care to their customers.

    And yes, I’m still in hospital.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  9. dmc12

    dmc12 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2018
    Messages:
    343
    Likes Received:
    218
    Completely agree. Nothing done for novices - especially given that it’s at Bedford, which they sell as their ‘best for first track day’ track.

    And I simply don’t see any world in which someone who causes an accident shouldn’t be sent home immediately. Yes there’s some grey in there in terms of practically establishing fault in the kind of incidents you’re likely to see - but *some* of them *are* black and white. So they need to have the *discretion* to send you home if you are incontrovertibly at fault.

    Re pace - yes I’d normally be front end of the inters (2.15ish pace) but I’m recovering from Long Covid at the moment so didn’t want to go balls out yesterday, was on my old slower bike (thankfully!) and the lap before I got taken out was 2.29 - so it wasn’t like I was Marquezing it round there, just a nice easy pace that unfortunately for the chump behind me wasn’t so nice or easy.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. dern

    dern Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2017
    Messages:
    180
    Likes Received:
    135
    Completely agree. I don't think they do much at all for novices at MSV. I did a day at Cadwell last year and very few of the people in the group were novices and the organisers were very difficult to get to talk to. I got stood up going in to Copice by someone dive bombing me which was where I called it a day. This kind of thing happened all day long and there seemed to be no control over it. The organisers camped in the area where you lined up to go out so weren't that accessible. I spoke to them about it and they suggested I come back in the week as they get more dickheads at the weekend. Not a great day. I have to say that all my days at Bedford have been good though but then I've had no problems.

    As a comparison though I did a day at Pembrey and they ran an extra briefing session for Novices that was really helpful. They also spotted and hauled the one guy who was dive bombing people and gave him a talking to. They may be direct talking miserable bastards but they run a bloody tight track day.

    There was also an extra 'New to the circuit briefing' at Combe but that was slightly defeated as they don't group by ability so there's a hell of a speed difference around there.
     
  11. PauloHRC

    PauloHRC God Like

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2017
    Messages:
    3,756
    Likes Received:
    2,757
    The last track day I did at Oulton I shared a garage with a few lads who were all signed up for the novice group, as was i. One was on a cbr 600rr and I would say was in the right group, One was on a zx10r, the other on a track prepared R6. They were both seriously quick. Turned out they were local to me and we exchanged numbers and I'm on a WhatsApp group with them now.......over the next few weeks it turned out they were getting ready for a racing season, posting pics of race bikes and camper vans and even sponsorship on the bikes. Couldn't quite believe it and my first thoughts were.....what the hell were they doing in the novice group when they're clearly not new to the track?

    This is the biggest problem I've found......people are just desperate to be at the front because they think it makes them look better. I dare say they'd of been fine in the fast group but they might have been shown up by faster riders.

    If people were just honest with their abilities track days might be a bit safer!:rolleyes:
     
    #31 PauloHRC, Sep 23, 2020
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2020
    • Agree Agree x 4
  12. Selmer50mark

    Selmer50mark Elite Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2016
    Messages:
    1,595
    Likes Received:
    1,100
    All this has kinda put me off track days , it seems I probably safer at 6am in the morning on my local road run . Hope you're back on the bike soon @dmc12 ;)
     
    • Like Like x 3
  13. Paul Longstaff

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2020
    Messages:
    444
    Likes Received:
    387
    I don't think its that, as when I've come across people clearly in a slower group than they should be its because the faster groups were full when they booked and as they wanted a track day on that specific date they just put themselves in a slower group rather than miss out
    Selfish gits
     
    • Agree Agree x 6
  14. dern

    dern Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2017
    Messages:
    180
    Likes Received:
    135
    Despite the above I really don't think you are and despite the above I'd still recommend it without reservation. Like anything the awareness of risk is required.
     
  15. Barstewardsquad

    Barstewardsquad God Like

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2012
    Messages:
    6,642
    Likes Received:
    3,037
    Whilst I have been on track a reasonable number of times I have never done a track day for the reasons above. I've spectated at many track days at Cadwell and the standard of some riders is atrocious with absolutely no respect or awareness of other riders, more than once I've thought someone was pushing too hard and then later see them in the van of shame, makes me wondet if I can see it how come the organisers can't?

    I've seen a few riders pulled off track, but normally that is after lots of complaints across multiple sessions, and then it tends to be after an instructor has tagged on behind them for a while.

    Maybe it is about time the organisers took a bit more control over who they accept for each day/group. Do they keep any record of who they have kicked off track, or which group a rider has previously signed up for?

    Fair does to those of you who do track days though, sometimes wish my possibly over protective sense of caution would let me do some, but then stories like this come up and Jimny Cricket sits there all smug saying "told you so"
     
    • Like Like x 1
  16. Marc

    Marc Member

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2019
    Messages:
    121
    Likes Received:
    139
    This for me is a great example of why the Ron Haslam school was so good. Yes it's more expensive than a normal track day but a) you learn a hell of a lot as you've got constant tuition, b) you're using someone else's bike/kit, and c) no one is on track without an instructor so when you catch slower riders their instructor has already seen you coming and moved them out of the way. Just such a shame that it's no more after this year.

    Main thing is you will mend and be in a position to get out there at some point in the future. Hope you get the gear sorted and the recovery is speedy.
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  17. Selmer50mark

    Selmer50mark Elite Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2016
    Messages:
    1,595
    Likes Received:
    1,100
    Yeah ..... fair coment Dern .
    Dick heads can crop up at anytime, had one overtake me when I'd clearly indicated to overtake another bike . He was trying to be a sports bike beater on his GS .
    spooked me :mad:
    But me being a nob gave chase just to give him the finger :(
    Red mist
     
    • Funny Funny x 3
  18. PauloHRC

    PauloHRC God Like

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2017
    Messages:
    3,756
    Likes Received:
    2,757
    Yes, I didn't think of that but fully agree what you're saying. ;)
     
  19. Slick

    Slick Elite Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2012
    Messages:
    2,334
    Likes Received:
    1,164
    Get well soon DMC!

    This happened to me too at my very first TD at Snetterton , some seriously fast chaps in the novices scared the bejesus out of me!!
    Nearly got taken on Agostini as well as nearly stacking on my own accord! Found out later they were racers doing some pre season preparations.
    It really put me off and it took months of mates convincing me to do another track day, did it with another provider on the same track and it was a totally different experience. Did several more track days but far too many close ones because of others being unpredictable.
    Never did make it into the inters, I think if I stepped up I would still be doing trackdays now
     
    #39 Slick, Sep 23, 2020
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2020
    • Like Like x 1
  20. TheMickster

    TheMickster Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2016
    Messages:
    372
    Likes Received:
    127
    Hi mate, who do you go with insurance wise, does one policy cover bike and injury? what's the excess on the bike like?
     

Share This Page